ND Mike I would think it’ll work like craigrice said might be hard to stuff maybe add a little water just to make it stuffable? Hope things work

Jamieson22 I do the same as ND Mike small chunks of almost frozen 1st grind meat. I don’t use the plunger unless to clear the throat once in a while. I also put the grinder head in the freezer overnight to help with overheating

These are beautiful. Great job!

Dr_Pain these are one of my favorite seasonings. Love em.

Jonathon I like the assuming you may not cook the bacon prior to consumption. Who used to eat bacon fresh off a cure without cooking it in some fashion? That is the interesting question to me.

craigrice said in Dry rub bacon question about cure?:

kevin page I would rewatch the videos and refer to the application chart for refrence

Kevin,
I wish I could be of some help to you but I have only wet cures bellies so far (for several years now).

I too wish to try the dry cure method. So I’ll be watching this thread.

Good N You Let us know the results of your experiments.

samspade said in After marinating:

Dr_Pain it’s a cheap 4 wired probe just gives temp and has a list of recomended temps for beef pork etc. Got it a walmart I think. It works good enough but for monitoring got the meatstick bridge set. Here’s a pic of the cheap one.

Screenshot_20211012-002849_Gallery.jpg

Thanks for the reply. I’ve been searching for some geek thermometer. I like to calibrate my stuff (because I don’t trust equipment) and was looking for high/low alarms sooooo… I had to spend the high dollars, but I had the wife’s blessing.

processhead - Looks great. I am going after elk in a couple weeks. I will have to try.

Ridley Acres I have vac sealed and used it six months later without a problem.

If you use Encapsulated Citric Acid don’t use Cold Phosphate - Sodium Phosphate but Sure Gel is fine. This is a good question and shows you are really thinking it through lcash74 good job and IVERYAN is also a nice answer. The real award though has to go to John Belvedere who must be the best meat processor in the State of NY. We do have some start cultures but we really don’t recommend them yet to retail customers. There is a lot of measuring of both temp and pH along with requirements for relative humidity that make it hard to manage at home. If we can ever find a reliable, affordable home dry curing cabinet we will dive deep into that but they are all insanely expensive and just seem to be getting either cheaper, or more expensive!

Dr_Pain As others have said, they are different products. We have done some testing with gelatin-based things and it doesn’t seem to work out well.

processhead Yes that was moisture sweated out during the cook.
I was trying to point out how little product weight was lost, although I never weighed before and after smoking to know what was lost doing it that way

Also note that I added a minimal amount of water during mixing, so in my case I started out with less moisture than when I smoke or oven process

I like the seasoning but maybe a touch on the weaker side. I find in most sausage I make, the flavor is better after it rest for a period of time. So I really need to taste it after it sits to know for sure if I should use more seasoning next time. I did cook a couple right after stuffing and they tasted like a salty hotdog. After smoking they taste like little smokies and the saltiness is gone. I actually think this would make a great snack stick.

mdseaside i agree the smoke is always good and the oil it really makes the snap.

Dr_Pain That will work. When I do smack sticks I cold smoke for about 3 to 4 hours then vacuum seal in bags and sous vide at 155 degrees for 2 1/2 hours. Then cool in an ice bath and unbag and let dry. Works great.

Phil Thomas When I make bacon I do have some fat that renders, I take the bacon to 150 IT. Some fat renders and drips out but with a drip or water pan underneath, it is all contained and the amount of fat lost is negligible for the added safety of taking the meat upto 150 ontop of the cure.

kyle What about drinking! We can’t all live parched.

RafterW johnsbrewhouse Thank you both so much! I ordered the ingredients and will be giving this a try very soon

the thing you lose is the color and texture. Safe food practices should be followed as with any fresh meat product. you can add celery, lettuce, or radishes (1 oz per pound but no promises on the flavor or color). If you have any ham or bacon cure .32oz per pound ( a teaspoon for 5lbs of meat)but add sugar to cut the affect of the salt in the cure

johnsbrewhouse said in Sausage Month:

Dr_Pain about what mine is, 28 miles, I have to drive into the city. I deboned 10 lbs. of quarters at a time and the last batch I tossed the bones since I had no use for another batch. It was a lot of work, but for the price as you said I could afford the failure. You got yours far cheaper, mine were $0.69/lb.

Yea, hard to beat $0.37/lbs these days. I have all the local stores weekly electronic flyers on my bookmark bar and just visit them weekly to see what is cheap and on sale.

LakeNeuron thanks for sharing some of your background. I am always interested in what everyone in this community does for a living or a hobby. It makes me feel like I know them. Again welcome aboard.

If it were a ground, cured and stuffed product, you could probably replicate the flavor. The texture might be something different though.

To get it in stick form means you have to grind it relatively fine so it can be stuffed in a casing.

Not to say it wouldn’t be tasty. It actually sounds pretty darn good. It just might not have the same texture as a formed ham product does. Dare I say it? mouth-feel, PapaSop ?!

Vintagechef I found them at a couple of places but dirtcheapcasings.com had them at a good price. You may have to call them I just tried their site and it was under construction.But I came up with a recipe and made 6 pounds last spring it came out pretty close to my memory of what it should be but I got a little heavy handed with the pepper. But the bags worked fine I soaked mine a few minutes before filling and that helped. I filled mine right off the grinder.I think Waltons may have the bags too.

processhead On the money as usual!! Thanks

Mcjagger There are a few different ones. I think johnsbrewhouse is correct, that is the best one to start with but I did do a few others so depending on your equipment setup:
https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/2271/tender-jerky-using-home-equipment
https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/3384/wild-game-walton-s-tender-venison-jerky
https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/2155/jerky-203-glycerin-in-place-of-sugar?_=1632764962335

samspade a neat little project

I hog ring and if not tight enough re-twist and add second hog ring

cdavis I try to check mine about every other week and usually find a couple I’ve accidently down voted.

Jonathon I’m not against nitrates ( I use them in my bacon) I usually make this sausage from fresh or frozen pork and once the sausage is made I will hang it inside my walk in cooler to dry and then it’s vacuum sealed

Surg It is a wealth of knowledge. I go back to it often and usually learn something new

bocephus said in Habanero BBQ Snack Sticks w/ Hot Pepper Cheese:

… nice to be appreciated even if it is only for food.

My personality pushes them away but my food brings them back! ;)

Jonathon said in Ground/Formed Venison Jerky:

processhead If you use willies to make restructured there are no changes that are needed. Restructured is similar enough to the cured sausage that a 1-1 ratio will be fine. Test batch might not be the worst idea though. Now, if you are using a jerky seasoning, like Walton's Bold Jerky Seasoning then you might use 5-10% more seasoning as we are going to loose less product by % of weight.

I never really understood why the different seasoning amounts used between whole muscle and ground jerky styles.

I would appreciate an explanation from someone who understands the reason behind this?

I use the supreme pizza (big hit getting kids into venison ), blue ribbon, hatch green Chile and the fanciest flavor is longanisa ,it is kinda like a teriyaki but with more flavor (garlic, pineapple, paprika)

High temp cheese available: mozzarella, pepper Jack, cheddar and ghost

ilxlr8u I don’t think you would want to use ECA and SMS together, they basically do the same thing although ECA gives you a tang that SMS does not.

GWG8541 Agreed. When I was contracting in Iraq for OIF it was not so much fun

Thank everyone!

Yes please. And feel free to put together a weekend class every quarter or so. I’d drive to that!

GWG8541
Local grocery has Wright Brand hickory smoked bacon for $4.99/lb. Probably should have stocked up as that s”is best commercial bacon ever and cheaper than my meat cost!

Miller havig never used Bear take my advice with a grain of salt but 8 minutes with wild game very well might not be enough. Time mixing is good in general but tons of things go into how long it will take. Things like amount of water added, quality of meat, TEMP of meat (that’s the big one) Temp of the room it is being mixed in and style of mixer (obviously) all of those things could be a culprit. Since you think it fatted out I am going to guess it could have been under mixed as like Cabelas90 says it is highly unlikely that a home processor would overmix, or you may possibly have a problem with your smoker, though I find that less likely than protein extraction.

thanks for the info

glen I need to serve them in about a month to Country Folks in Texas. Debating whether to use liver at all or not.

Jonathon said in Snack sticks without ECA refrigerator time?:

TANG IS KING! But, if you dont like it Smoked Meat Stabilizer and if you have a very accurate scale then Sodium Erythorbate works as a cure accelerator as well and it imparts no tang.

Is there any advantage of using sodium erythorbate instead of smoked meat stabilizer?

Quick report back. So I made a 1.5lb batch. It came out pretty good but I think I’d cut back a little on how much I added. I used 30 grams for the 1.5lbs. Every rub is going to be different. This is a saltier rub so I’d probably knock it to 20 grams next time. Feedback so far was that it was preferred over the PS seasonings Cajun mix with pepper jack cheese which really surprised me.

It shouldn’t change safety wise so long as you keep the cure (pink salt) at the recommended rate.

processhead
Thinking back I believe I used a cotton tie from a hoodie.

Hi Ridley, I used a 3/16 for the final grind, and yes I did use a food processor to emulsify, although it did struggle so I ended up doing it in 2 batches, I think Grimpuppy told me he did his in 3 batches. I did indeed like the final texture. I also let the cure set overnight before I sous vide the product. I was over all very happy with the final product. I had tried a couple of times on a smoker, but the fat just bleed out, the sous vide worked great.

cdavis yeah, I’m hoping one of the guys behind the counter just screwed up with the pricing machine.

Jamieson22 looks really good 👍

Grimpuppy Should work fine, especially if you have back fat to add if needed.

Grimpuppy looks good. Now I’m hungry for jerky.

Tex_77 Thank you. Gives me enough information to treat this well, and get more than just ground meat.

Freddie said in turkey snack sticks:

I am thinking about making some snack sticks out of ground turkey. I was thinking of using Willie’s snack stick seasoning and cheddar cheese. Has anyone tried this specific combination? Or would another combination be better? TIA

Wild turkey or domestic? In either case, turkey is pretty lean and would benefit from the addition of some fat from pork like twilliams says.

twilliams Tubed hog casing, it has something to do with the chicken product is what I am thinking. I’ve used the same casing from the same batch previously with no issues. I don’t buy collagen casings, so it can’t be that.

TinCupTom Looks good to me

HerbcoFood said in Corned beef cure:

processhead I do smoked pastrami for venison every year.

Yes, same here.
That’s what had me thinking about trying a batch without smoking ala-corned beef.

I have a mix of all types of non-edible casings and would like to know how to tell the difference between the Non-edible FIbrous and Non-edible Collagen? From looking at the pictures on various sites they look the same.

mitch0700 Yes, Sure Gel is a powdered milk product with some phosphate

twilliams said in Knocked out 50lb of sausage today - Andouille and Sheboygan Brat:

PapaSop so here is the equivalents ranging from largest to smallest.
10mm= 25/64” or .39”
3/8”= .38” or 9.53mm
7mm= 9/32” or .28”
3/16”= .19” or 4.76mm
1/8”= .13” or 3.18mm

So you are actually grinding a second time at a smaller diameter than I do.

Interesting. Yeah, I’m happy with that 7mm second grind and getting no complaints from anyone. As far as trying to copy a Johnsonville, it probably won’t happen. Tried myself.

Grimpuppy
Nicely done.

I have been curing and cold smoking bacon for the last few years…bellies and loins…so much better than what you can purchase. I have a small MES30 that I cold smoke in
…Yours look gorgeous!

Jesser When I do smack sticks i always let them cool in the fridge in an open container at least over night or even a little more to let them dry before packing and freezing.

I am not a big fan of cheese in my snack sticks, it’s a texture thing for me.

HerbcoFood good reference

Before I found Waltons I had been doing jerky for years. I have always used Hi Mountain jerky seasoning. The cure that comes with their kit is 0.625% nitrates. You have to use more of it and it has to sit for 24 hours in the fridge. Then I either cook it in the oven or the smoker at 200 degrees until it hits 160. This is how the instructions that come with it say to do it. I have always had excellent results.

Then I found Walton’s and meatgistics. This is the first time I had heard of bringing it up to 160 fast and then turn temp down and finish till desired texture.

Fast forward to last week. I bought another Hi Mountain kit to make jerky. The box was different shape than before. I opened the kit and noticed the cure pack was a lot smaller and in a foil pack. I opened the cure and it was 6.25% pink cure instead of the previous 0.625% cure. I looked at the directions and noticed they were different. After reading through they say only needed to sit 4 hours now for cure to work but instructed to put in oven at 375 and bring the internal to 160 before smoking or dehydrating. This is a big shift from their previous instructions. So I will assume there is some validity in the bring it to 160 fast method.

Just fyi, not endorsing the brand of seasoning I mentioned. Just what I have always used with good results. With the price of eye of round, hate to experiment with something new. I will someday give excalibur jerky seasoning a try.

ISULarry Often times I find that I can slice bacon without cutting it by placing it on a diagonal, i.e. lift up the back end of the slab. Can use a block of wood, just keep it from hitting the blade.

It will likely add about 2" to the total cut, which is often enough to cut the whole slab.

Jamieson22 they look good to me. If they taste as good as they look 😋 you’re all good.

After discovering Sure Gel about 6-7 years ago I rarely mess with full muscle

processhead Thanks, I went in and changed them, except of course all the ones about signing up for team blue!

Jamieson22 those look great

I definitely recommend the imitation bacon flavoring. My younger brother wanted to try it so I made some with venison and added the imitation bacon flavor, turned out very good and now he wants more. I told him just as soon as he supplies the venison!

glen You do not have to pack the entire length. I kind of thread it from the tube it comes on to my stuffer tube and cut it (through casing and plastic tube) when I think I have enough. This leaves the remains on the casing tube as it came and I don’t have to worry about it picking up any sausage meat that may spoil. I then shake off as much water as I can and put in sandwich bag coated in kosher salt.

Jonathon

DF009E25-7B8D-47CD-97A4-B49F1F0D583F.jpeg

I have smoked 27 lbs of venison summer sausage in my PK100. Used the 40 mm x 18 in Collagen Casings. I just put two racks in the top position and ran chop sticks thru the casing loops. Came out fantastic. 😎 I like the smaller 1lb. Tubes because I give them to a lot of friends. They are also about the perfect size for ritz crackers when sliced. I do have some friends that eat these one pounders like they are snack sticks.🤤 I used Waltons Ton Summer Unit seasoning, outstanding.

bocephus A few years ago my wife bought me a fly rod and on the occasional windless day (rare in kansas) I go out on my pond and try fly fishing. I’ve got bass and sunfish on it but don;t really get the chance to take it anywhere where I could catch anything really cool with it. A muskie on a fly-rod would be intense! Good luck with that!

I like venison pastrami and I make it every year, I just cant find my recipe that I use at this moment.

processhead I really don’t count the pork fat its self, I just cut up the pork butt and added in how much was necessary for my liking. I did add in some bacon this year and we like the results.

YooperDog said:

Jamieson22 looks like a great product and lots of learning going. Some of the best ways to get experience is hands on.

Surg said:

Jamieson22
Nicely done!! They look delicious.

Thanks to you both! Been doing BBQ for so darn long it is like cruise control and have to admit nailing this sausage process has been a challenge but am loving it. Still not 100% happy with my outcomes but they are still delicious and getting better each time. This group certainly has a lot to do with that!

JoeB said in Sous Vide questions:

Also the tops are inter changeable. Only have to prep one top

Perfect. Was hoping they were the same size so I could use this larger cooler for holding finished meats when necessary. Sometimes when butts are cheap I’ll load my Pitts & Spitts up and offer to friends/neighbors so cooking 9+ butts at a time isn’t uncommon.

I would make your usual sausage recipe then put it in your stuffer or jerky gun. As you press it out a small diameter tube, cut it off in small pieces with a knife or sharp scissors. This will make it like tiny meatballs. Just fry it up carefully without breaking it up.

Bear fat is pretty different stuff. It tends to render at very low temperatures. I would try mixing it with a decent percentage of lean pork. 50/50 maybe?

vnmsupply The icon that is the 2nd to last on the right will take you to a link that has 1 and 5 lb batches split out for most seasonings. A few of the newest ones might not be on there yet.
18a60d30-9cce-4c0a-a732-54219dec666d-image.png

Saxman you are correct, can be used as a fresh bratwurst without the pink stuff (pink cure) or a cured bratwurst with the pink stuff (pink cure). You can even make snack sticks or summer sausage with it. The fresh bratwurst can not be smoked but the other items that you add the pink cure to can be smoked.

Ray Hines said in My first attempt at hot dogs:

Grimpuppy said in My first attempt at hot dogs:

.4 oz smoked meat stabilizer
.2 oz hickory smoke powder
1.2 oz sure gel
4.8 oz Frank and Bologna unit

?? What kind of ingredients are these? Not sure I would even bother with this. Not being mean, but, what is the salt, pepper, mace, coriander, etc… content? I always like to know what spices (or perservatives) are in my food. Guessing the outcome is worse than having monosodiumwhatthehell in a store-bought hotdog.

Smoked meat stabilizer is a cure accelerator. It lets you go strait to the smoker without holding it overnight in the fridge.

Hickory smoke powder is just that. Imparts a little extra smoke flavor.

Sure gel to help bind it all together.

Frank and Bologna unit is Waltons hot dog seasoning. It has all the spices pre measured and mixed so there is no guessing.

Nonfat dry milk added as a binder is generally used in amounts that are not detectable as a flavor.
Its pretty common in processed foods of all kinds.

Jonathon Yup! I generally go with the largest stuffed horn I can get away with.

Benjamminn If it’s already in it I wouldn’t think you would need more?

wdaly

Yeah I’ve been doing sticks on my Pitts & Spitts Maverick 1250 pellet smoker but it only goes down to 180F. I ordered a PK 100 to fill that low temp niche my current grills/smokers don’t.

smokinbubba Thank you, Sir. I completely agree with getting real cautious. But, with this information I will be running another batch very soon.

Oh! So it’s an even more diluted brine than is used when wet brining? I thought using a vacuum tumbler is supposed to reduce the amount of ingredients needed.

There is food grade and non-food grades of dry ice. Dry ice is approved for use in ground meat. https://www.burtekdryice.com/meat-processing/#:~:text=Food grade dry ice is,beyond what is legally allowed).

kyle we are also on well water here, great water but just for being uniform I use distilled water. Not sure I can tell any difference.

I’m looking back at your question and realizing I didn’t really answer.

Frankly, I don’t grind twice anymore, and I don’t intend to do so unless and until I do some emulsified sausage. I just use whatever plate I find appropriate. I’m just doing this as a hobby to please myself and those around me, and I found that I get very little (if any) bang for the buck out of a second grind. I would much rather grind once through my 3mm (1/8") plate than do a second grind

Now, if I had infinite time, a larger grinder, and a dedicated cold room where I could keep all my processing stuff, then I might change my answer. However, I don’t. I gotta tell you, I am very happy with the texture of what I’m cranking out, and I have folks slapping the table when they try it.

That said, I am pretty much sold on the idea of grinding fat no larger than 4.5mm (3/16"). Fat out becomes a much bigger problem at coarser grinds. It’s not that you can’t manage it, but it’s much more difficult. It’s certainly worth the small effort to separate the large chunks of fat in pork butt, beef chuck, and chicken thighs, and then to switch plates (and knives) if you are grinding your leaner bits at coarser than 4.5mm.

YooperDog yep. Gotta save that grease. Makes the best fried taters!

T Jake If noone else has suggested it then go with the High Temp Ghost Pepper Cheese

Mathew, I use 20-22 sheep casing for breakfast sausage, 30-32 for brats and Italian sausage and 32-35 for Kielbasa. Hope this helps

Jamieson22 looks like a nice batch of sticks. Yes, for the most part you get what you pay for.

Branson Tolliver Maybe try adding some maple sugar to your meat block for the flavor you are looking for

BRYARRR_80 I’m also alerting commercial sales that you’ll be contacting them, you could also email [email protected]

glen excellent description