Jonathon thanks will have a look

HoustonSmoker bringing you snack sticks and summer sausage to 160 is key for a long shelf life. My first time making snack sticks I did not make sure they got to the proper temp and had mold problems within a week. After that I went to the 160 mark and have had no issues with spoilage. I have had them in the fridge over a month with no,problems.

Hunting skills and a high powered rifle!

i’d have to look at my notebook but i’m pretty sure we use 1oz for 20# of meat.

gadahl Thanks for the compliments! It’s great to see people absorbing this information and putting it to practical use, that is the purpose of all of this afterall. I absolutely agree on the Bacon, super simple to do either way but being able to inject one day and then smoke the next makes injecting it the way to go in my mind.

As for the Will it BBQ? section it started out as just doing some interesting things on the BBQ but it has quickly evolved into a competition to see who can come up with the weirdest thing to try! It got really strange when we started taking suggestions on what to try next. We have some unappetizing ones coming up that seem more like a dare than anything else but they should be fun, for us at least!

AndyMan: It may help you to take a look at my post from August “Summer Sausage Nightmare” and the replies from Jonathan and others. Looking back, my problem was a lack of mixing the meat properly. I was not getting enough protein extraction, so the fat in the meat was cooking out during smoking. This left the Summer Sausage tasting dry and with the mouth feel of a sawdust log. I purchased one of the meat mixers from Walton’s and it fixed this problem. My small 20 pound mixer was not expensive and does a great job mixing the meat. It’s well made and easy to clean.

Also, by following the smoking times suggested by Waltons and keeping a pan of water in the smoker my sausage was “stalling out” in the last critical hour of the smoke process–never reaching an internal temp of 160F. Of course, your product must be brought up to 160F internal temp if you expect to be safe from food bacteria. We don’t want to make people sick with our sausage. For me, the solution, as suggested by several of the “Old Pros” who follow this site, was to stop smoking after about four hours and transfer the product to a heated water bath to bring the internal temp up to 160F. I was getting to 145F - 150F in the smoker, but couldn’t close the gap to 160F. About 15 min. in a hot water bath (slightly below boiling) did the trick. The sausage comes out of the water fully cooked, casings full and tight, without wrinkles, and the fat is fully emulsified.

Best of luck with your sausage.

G.

We put the ghost pepper cheese and habanero powder in our sticks and it’s awesome. The pepper jack also has a great flavor, neither are as hot as you’d think when you mix it in. We also use cheddar for our mild stick. Walton’s has a great selection of high temp cheese! I will warn you that if you use a 17mm stick the cheese can stick in the stuffing tube, I gut shot my buddy standing at the end of the table with one, he went down like a soccer player!

1GRINDER I always like adding encapsulated citric acid as well. However, as you said if you don’t have a smoker big enough to do the entire batch at one you can’t process it all at once and add ECA. My suggestion would be to just split it into batches that your smoker can handle! Good job planning everything out, that is an important step that a lot of people miss!

IVERYAN I would love to hear the results as I used a replacement citric acid and did not know you could not keep and I have a 50 lb. batch I had to hold in fridge overnight, so I’m worried.

TinCupTom I think you are talking about adding Smoked Meat Stabilizer instead of the Encapsulated Citric Acid? If that is the case then you would not want to use them together, use one or the other. The Smoked Meat Stabilizer will not offer the same level of tanginess that the Citric Acid will, it does contain ascorbic acid but it is not enough to offer a noticeable level of tanginess.

There really isn’t anything to use in place of the Encapsulated Citric Acid to offer the same level of tang. I use the Citric Acid in almost everything I do as I also love the taste it adds. So, if you are looking for that I would just go with the Encapsulated Citric Acid instead of the smoked meat stabilizer.

Now, if you were talking about Sure Cure instead of Smoked Meat Stabilizer then yes, you want to use them together as the Citric Acid will work as a cure accelerator and also adds the tanginess!

pramey3 It’s been awhile since I made it but I want to say the recipe called for 2-3 lbs and I used half of that and it came out great.

DaFish13 Yes, you can leave it in the fridge for a few days before smoking as long as it has already been stuffed. It is not ideal to go too much past 24 hours but it should not hurt anything. The taste might be a little different as the seasoning will have more time to interact with the meat but I don’t think it will be anything detrimental to the quality of your sausage!

Kentucky Fisherman The second grind is always going to be slower and this is doubly true when going from a 3/8th plate to a 1/8 plate. By breaking the meat down into a ground product you are making it harder for the grinder to push the meat down to the plate and knife and you are also trying to make it go through a smaller plate. Best thing i can tell you to fight this is to get your meat ICE COLD before grinding, some ice crystal forming on the meat is just about right! This will speed up the process and improve your finished product.

With it looking like bologna I have the feeling your 1/8 plate, or the knife you use with it, are in need of sharpening or replacement. What you are describing sounds like your plate and knife are smooshing your meat instead of cutting it cleanly.

As for the stuffing, yes, trying to stuff snack sticks off of a stuffer is incredibly difficult, frustrating and annoying! It is much easier to use a stuffer when making any type of sausage but especially when making snack sticks.

Thank you for the great information.i will make it how you said .

stan
I have never tried a chicken summer sausage. We usually do chicken brats or chicken snack sticks. There are a lot of similarities between snack sticks and summer sausage, just a larger diameter though.

If anyone else has tried chicken summer sausage, I hope they’ll chime in and let us know their results too! I think we’ll have to add chicken summer sausage to our list of things to try and put out an exact recipe on.

You can use approximately 1.6 ounces of carrot fiber for 10 lb of meat (4 oz per 25 lb of meat is normal usage).

Biggest change to the cooking cycle would be to cook to 165 degrees since it is poultry.

Poultry can also have a bigger tendency to “stall” during smoking, so try to add a water pan if there is room to help keep humidity as high as possible.

My only last comments would be to make sure and get good protein extraction while mixing everything. That with a binder or additive like carrot fiber will help bind up as much water as possible to keep a lean meat like chicken as moist as possible.

Good luck and let us know if we can help with anything else!

Austin
Thanks for the info. I’m not sure what the weight was of the cure because the butcher prepared it for me but it was only about 2 cups worth so I was concerned I was short on cure for the brine. Just guessing but I dont believe the 2 cups weighed out to 1.75lb. I should be close though so I’ll be throwing her on the smoker tomorrow. Thanks again.

Thanks,

I figured that would be the case, but wanted get the experts opinion.

Ed_Orum
Does the meat have less firmness than any other type of “normal” sausage? I wonder if you are comparing stiffness and texture to a dry cured pepperoni…? What some people think of as pepperoni is not processed in the same way as other sausages like brats, summer sausage, snack sticks, etc. It can be a true dried sausage that is fermented and dry cured, but not ever truly cooked or thermally processed. That is a lot of what gives pepperoni it’s hard firmness and specific texture when eating. That is just not something that can be completely replicated in a cooked sausage. I think the dryness is a big key there, but the texture cannot be fully emulated if we are comparing something thermally processed to not.

Other than that, what I think is one of the best ways to make pepperoni, without doing the old-world dry cured and fermented sausage, is what we go through in our standard pepperoni recipe shown here: https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/545/how-to-make-homemade-pepperoni-recipe
I would check out your process compared to that one, and see if there are things you can change to match it.
The last time we made pepperoni here, it was amazing!!

kb2112
As long as it is not molding and appearance is normal, I would feel comfortable using it. It usually only lasts a few months before molding, or up to 12-18 months in the freezer. If it seems dried out, or any mold growth, then I would discard.

BevH
It is possible to stuff off a grinder, but it isn’t optimal. You get a more consistently stuffed product with a sausage stuffer, it is usually easier, and you get less air pockets, an even fill, and overall better results. Nothing wrong with doing it off a grinder though if that is all you have or just your preference.

Ed_Orum
I think you used the wrong casings. As Joe Hell says, you used “snack stick” casings, but you should use the 21 mm Fresh or Natural Sheep casings for breakfast sausage. If you do that, you’ll be much happier with the result!

The high salt content of “H” may be masking the pepper and/or other seasonings.

I’ve had that happen. It’s due to oxidation before cooking. The meat on the outside will absorb oxygen from the air after stuffing but before cooking when you let them rest in casings that long. I know direction but, I’ve found that a 1 hour stay in the deep freeze is better than over night int he refrigerator, then right to cooking/smoking, then ice bath after. More uniform color that way. Te bicolored stuff is fine to eat, just doesn’t look as pretty on crackers.

I don’t use an accelerator, just a good mixing and cold.

I do cured venison hams as well. Very good, nothing like a pork ham, closer to tasting like corned beef than tasting like ham. Same as a pork ham, so I’m curious to see the OP’s recipe.

Jonathon yep, shorter horn makes sense. I am mech. engineer and there are two big things wrong here: the 9.5mm (3/8") stuffer tube and its length. Most of the problem, probably, ALL could be solved by using the diameter stuffer tube for 16 mm casings. There is NO advantage to going smaller, just disadvantages. Pressure drop(in this case back pressure on the cylinder / piston goes up exponentially as diameter is reduced.

thanks. As it turned out I did use a pork butt, cost only $1.48/# on sale and pork fat appears to be running about 50 cents more. Pure fat is a lot harder to come by, guessing because there is just less of it – supply and demand. One recipe I was using called out pork fat and I directly substituted the ground pork butt and it tasted fine even at a 25% ratio. The other sausage experimental batch I made with 50% and it is even better. So, 50/50 is the future now. thanks for your input folks!

excellent, thanks.

schreib everything lamurscrappy said is correct! I have yet to try a seasoning that I like when using pork or beef, that I don’t like on venison. The most important thing when using any wild game like deer or elk that is low in fat content is to add enough pork fat. Venison by itself has very little intramuscular fat or fat caps so adding pork fat fixes this. Now, you could also use fat from beef or other sources but pork fat is unique in that it has a really nice creaminess to it, so that is why we recommend that.

When adding pork fat the best time to do it is during the grinding process, this will help everything get mixed in really well. If you add it during the mixing process you run the risk of the protein coating the fat but not really mixing with the meat.

JakeTeal Hi Jake, did you use encapsulated citric acid or another cure accelerator? The reason I ask is that you pointed out that you held them overnight and if you didn’t use any type of cure accelerator then holding it overnight is what you are supposed to do, to allow the cure time to work. If you used Citric Acid and held it overnight then there is the chance that the encapsulation broke and started the acid started interacting with the meat too soon. This can cause some consistency issues, though normally it is a dry and crumbly edge, not a mush, that is possible too.

The next thing I would guess is that you have a protein extraction problem, people who read all the “what went wrong?” posts on here must be tired of reading me say that but it’s so often the issue! You want to mix, in a meat mixer until you have the proper level of protein extraction, this binds the protein, fat, water and any other additives together. For a good example of what proper protein extraction looks like go to the 1:20 mark of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wStH-RtQUY8 , the entire thing is worth watching but that will show you what your meat should look like.

Another question would be what temp was the meat at when you were processing it? It could also be that your meat was denaturing and the proteins were all breaking apart, nothing would have saved it at that point. Before grinding your meat should be as cold as possible, ice crystals just starting to form is the perfect temp. As a bonus cold meat also grinds and stuffs better, this is especially true on products that are going to get a second grind like snack sticks.

Also, we always recommend Excalibur Seasonings and not just because that is what we sell! Excalibur has an incredibly high standard of processing and a bad batch from them without the correct salt content is unbelievably rare.

With cooking, it sounds like what happened in the end is you got case hardening. Tons of things could have caused this but what happens is the outside ring of the meat cooks and hardens and it will not pass any more heat to the inside of the meat, it holds and even deflects it instead of passing it along into the center of the meat. Not sure what Traeger you were using but adding a water pan, or another way of introducing humidity, is a good idea that will speed up cook times and give you a more moist product.

Lastly, (I know, finally right?!) pellet grills are notorious for having cold spots and hot spots, so unless you were rotating them you absolutely could have had some spots that were 15-20° cooler than others! I took the Grilleye and mapped out my pellet grill so I know where to avoid or when I have a full grill where I need to rotate.

If you want to give me more of your process I can try to see what else it might have been?

gadahl Okay, I think I see part of the confusion, the label on the bag for the Blue Ribbon Maple Bacon Cure says “Use 2 lb of cure to 100 lb of fresh bellies. This imparts 120 ppm of nitrite and 547 ppm of erythorbate” As the bags have 5 lb of cure this means you would get 2.5 batches out of each bag and each batch does 100 lb of meat so it is enough to cure 250 lb of bellies.

If you are looking at a bag and it says something other than “Use 2 lb of cure to 100 of fresh bellies” please let me know!

As for the math at the end of your post, you wouldn’t use 5 lb of cure to 5 gallons of water, you would use 5 lb of cure to 2.5 gallons of water. Each gallon weighs 8.34 lb so 2.5 x 8.34 = 20.85 (water), 20.85 + 5 lb (cure) = 25.85 and with that you could pump 250 lb of fresh bellies.

Let me know if I did not understand something correctly!

Jonathon I made 10 lb of it. I used 6 lb of pork, 4 lb of lean beef and the 10 lb 4.6 Bologna Casing along with the Lebanon Bologna Seasoning and then I added the X-tra Hot Red Pepper at the usage of 3 oz to 100 lb of meat. I also used some Sodium Erythorbate and Sure Gel. It came out amazing! Seriously, it might have been the best thing I have ever made here! Then today I made Fried Bologna sandwiches out it, all around just a great product!

schreib
Most places don’t have a 2" opening on a stuffing tube for a sausage stuffer. It simply can’t get that big because the f****e (part that attaches to the stuffer) is only about 2-1/8". The largest we offer is 38mm (approximately 1.5") https://www.waltonsinc.com/waltons-38mm-ss-stuffing-tube

What you might be seeing is a 2" opening on a grinder stuffing tube, like this one: https://www.waltonsinc.com/22-2-stuffing-horn

If you can get one that is 2", bigger is always better when filling larger meat bags and casings, but the difference between 1.6" and 2" on a sausage stuffer will be pretty minimal. Every little bit can help though. We do always recommend going with the largest stuffing tube possible that fits your casing, meat bags, etc. It’s not a requirement, just a best practice to make things easier.

andrewsc I agree that fermented and slow cured is a different taste. Many would say, and I am included in that many, that it is a better taste. But, there are also people who don’t like it as much as just quick cured and smoked. The fat starts to go rancid and that is the smell/taste that sets it apart. Again, I prefer that taste but not everyone does!

It is 100% worth doing at least once for the experience and the taste!

papaG hi thanks for your reply. I will have to look at Walton snack stick stick tutorial. I have made snack sticks but sometimes when I make them when I get the ph or water activity tests back I find that one or the other is outside of the acceptable ranges for shelf stable so I wondered how much citric acid or water to use so i could get consistant results.

Those you mentioned sound awesome, I’d like to see that video. I would also like to try them.

Douglas Moore Nice thing about breakfast sausage is that it is one of the easiest things to make! We’ve done a few videos but the most recent is in the meatgistics university section, the video is here on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=191wAfItiGY and for the article check out here https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/755/fresh-sausage-107-basic-breakfast-sausage-processing.

Holly is a great choice by far our best selling breakfast sausage.

Quick tips would be to make sure plates and knives on the grinder are sharp and lubricated. Keep your meat cold through the grinding and stuffing process and make sure the seasoning is really well mixed in with the meat. Enjoy!

Thank you, I will remember that if/when I try duck again.

Just an FYI, everybody that received snack sticks for Christmas last year loved them… I just ordered another batch of Willie’s Snack Stick spice blend to do it again this year!

21cedar That’s a great question on the phospshates, I have never thought of that. Let me talk to some people next week and see if there is a scientific reason behind it. I’ll warn you though it probably wont be until later in the week. We are working around the clock to get Meatgistics University ready for our 4 PM (CST) live time on Monday! We’ll have it all ready, just don’t be surprised if you tune in to our live stream at waltonsinc.com/live and Austin and I look a little haggard!

medeling32 What @Boudreaux said is perfectly fine. You could make it with anything you want, 100% beef, 100% pork will work too! The biggest thing to know if you are going lower than 20-30% pork is that the texture will be a little different than you might be used to. Pork fat has a creaminess to it that beef fat just does not have, this is why it generally makes the best Sausage and Snack Sticks.

Leland We made them today! We had to make some changes to the seasoning composition to have the correct salt content (fancy way of saying we added some extra salt!) and the taste was excellent! Im not sure where it would go in my ist of favorite snack sticks but it would be in the top 10 no question. I think I actually liked them better than I like the chicken I marinated in the General Tso’s.

We should have the video edited, uploaded and live in the next few weeks.

We appreciate you guys being patient with us, we know we haven’t been releasing anything recently but that will all pay off around October 22nd when we go live with almost 30 Meatgistics University videos at once!

bill k Yes, for a 5 lb batch you would use .075 of a pound which is 1.2 oz or 34 grams. We have conversion charts for Seasonings and Cures, looks like we need to do one on additives as well! I will get started on that fairly shortly here, I think it would add some value for our users. I had a package of it here so I decided to weigh it out and 1.2oz or 34 grams of Excalibur Sure Gel would be 3 tablespoons and 1 teaspoon.

LT205 Thanks I will give it a try.

bill k
Yes, that would be correct.
Typically we recommend 1 or 2 quarts of water per 25 lb of meat for snack sticks.
Thus, 6.4 to 12.8 ounces of water for a 5 lb batch would be perfect!

@tswohl Thanks ,I will print off and keep it on file . cheers leland

wildcat
The Morton’s stuff has more cure than just “pink salt”. It has nitrates in it too. The easiest way to replicate it is to use the version from Excalibur. They have custom matches for both the regular and smoke flavored version.

Look on the cure page here for the “MRT” cures:
https://www.waltonsinc.com/seasonings/cures

Weathered100 First, great question! Second, Parksider , as usual, is correct. Adding cure to a meat product is going to retard the growth of botulism spores but it is not going to make the meat safe to eat by itself, it still needs to get to 160° to fully kill off any harmful bacteria growing inside it. The same is true with Smoked Meat Stabilizer, it speeds up that conversion of Nitrite to nitric oxide faster than E. Coli can grow but it won’t kill it on its own, it still needs thermal processing to make it safe to consume.

As far as moving it to water, I have never done it but there is no reason it would not work and with a summer sausage the only “smoke” you would lose is what has accumulated on the outside of the fibrous casing. As you don’t eat a fibrous casing, this will not affect the taste.

I would vac pack it first just to be sure but I also don’t think finishing cooking it in water would make it watery. In fact, I think I would more worry about the opposite, that it would cook too much of the moisture out of the meat by cooking it directly in water.

Having said that though, if Parksider has done it in the past and has not seen any noticeable deficiency in his finished product I would say it is probably fine to do it that way!

I have tried a TF 34MM processed casing I got from Quality Casings. A 32MM HF and a 30MM TF, both clear processed, I got from Mar-Co Sales. Devro Is the brand I have now. I have been hanging them. the 30MM has been the best but still tougher than I want. Ideally I want a 32MM processed casing for my brats. Does Walton’s send out samples? I do have to order some other items.

After Googling the word Pink Slime this is two articles I found .

1.Pink slime
Food
“Pink slime” is a meat by-product used as a food additive to ground beef and beef-based processed meats, as a filler, or to reduce the overall fat content of ground beef. In the production process, heat and centrifuges remove fat from the meat in beef trimmings. The resulting paste is exposed to ammonia gas or citric acid to kill bacteria. In 2001, the United States Department of Agriculture approved the product for limited human consumption. Lean finely textured beef" (LFTB prepared using ammonia gas is banned for human consumption in the European Union.

2.“Pink slime” (ammoniated boneless lean beef trimmings) is the nickname earned by a formerly inedible byproduct of the beef industry. Once used in pet food, it’s now a cheap additive in ground beef. Pink Slime is an additive that the federal government has approved to be mixed in with ground beef.

Please, please GRIND YOUR OWN the United States Department of Agriculture ( USDA ) does not seem to care what the general public eats.

0_1536968893279_3be659fa-85c1-4df9-b3fc-7a0f5cf1c5b6-image.png

Hello all,

I am hoping someone can help me out. I acquired a Gander Mountain meat grinder. There are 2 bolts on top, one is an oil stopper. I remove that bolt, look inside the grinder and see oil, when running the oil level goes down when stopped comes back up.

Does anyone know what oil to use and how much?

Thank you for any advice

jf549 Thanks for the clarification! I don’t think it would have ruined it had you cold smoked it for 6 hours, I just wouldn’t have recommended it!

lateasusual I prefer Carrot Fiber to Potato Starch but tbone is right, it is more readily available in stores and the fact that it begins to gel at around the same temperature that meats starts to really excrete water is a huge benefit. Super Bind gives you the best of both worlds as it has Carrot Fiber and Potato Starch but I don’t know if it is twice as good as carrot fiber as it is almost twice the price!

Parksider A lot of people mix in the seasoning either before they grind or between the first and second grind. If I didn’t have a mixer, and I was making a cured product where I needed protein extraction, I might add the seasoning after the first grind and then grind it again. I don’t do it this way with a cured product because it is usually a while until I can get to cleanup and seasoned meat seems to be harder to clean than unseasoned. I wouldn’t do this if making a fresh product as I’d worry about the protein extraction starting too soon but that is probably me just being overly careful.

Mixing the water in with the seasoning before the meat is fine and plenty of people do it. In the end, it really shouldn’t make any difference as long as you mix the meat enough once it is all added. However, I always tell people if they have found something that works for them don’t change! If that process works for you (and considering the sized batches you do who could argue with it?) then stick with it!

I really dont think the temp had anything to do with it. I do about 200lbs of bacon a year and I smoke cook mine till I get an internal temp of 155 and then shut it down and let them hang in the smoker for 30 min after and my finish temp is at about 158-160. Mine always turns out tender.

I would say it wasn’t the best of pork that was sold.

Jonathon I put them on before I seal so maybe that is the problem…I’ll give it a try after sealing. I use Avrey weatherproof labels and run them through my HP color laser printer.

tbone Glad that the taste was great! If you are using a non-stuck casing then yes you do want to perforate it, this allows for the sausage to bleed out of the casing and then the casing to form tightly to the meat. What sort of casing were you using? If it was a fibrous casing you still shouldn’t have had this issue but if it was plastic I can see that happening. The time it took to get there seems pretty high but you weren’t in any danger there, the cure had you covered.

It sounds like too much water was used in the mixture, I know you used carrot fiber, how much water did you use for your 10 lb chub? I would suspect that the correct level of protein extraction was not reached, the water should have been bound up in the meat better than that. Now, I know that some people reading this will be saying to themselves, or maybe even out loud, there he goes blaming protein extraction like he ALWAYS DOES! Well, that is because it is so often the issue with any cooking problems you might have. Seriously, if you are making a cured product, once you have gotten what you think is good protein extraction mix for another 3 minutes or so, it will help!

I’d also try using a probe thermometer and check the actual temperature of your smoker. If you set it for 150° is it actually there or did it only reach 140°, the easiest way to do this is with a probe thermometer system like the GrillEye or the GrillEye Pro Plus, they come with a clip that allows the probe to not touch the metal so it will give you an accurate reading.

So, in short I think you are right in what happened though, I think the meat released all of the added water and then that created a barrier and it was having problems passing meat through that and then into the center of the meat. That should never have happen to that extent though and I think protein extraction was more of the culprit!

Hope this helped, let me know if you need anything else.

I have found that putting some vinegar or lemon, will definitely help with the smell, but I have found that the addition of either or helps soften and make the casing more pliable and much easier to work with.
After some trials, I’m hooked on using lemon juice, about 1/4 a cup per qt of water.

MMMMMM I was going to add Citric acid so maybe I’ll adjust and maybe do half one way.
Thanks for info.Tarp.

Save your money and don’t spend a dime on that machine. I got the Weston #22 1.5hp pro series and it’s worrh every penny. Walton’s carries and sharpens every size plate and blade. Not the throw away ones from big box stores. Keep in mind they supply processors so you are getting pro level equipment. Buy with confidence!!!

renaldo Thanks for that! We always appreciate people helping each other and pointing them to the right info on our website! lateasusual Another good tip would be to watch the corresponding video in the Learning Center for the product you are making as it will tell you how much water to use per batch. Hope your sausages came out great!

I always make patties out of the left over in the tube and the bottom of the stuffer. I am working on a video now to go over a few different things to do with that, if anyone has any suggestions other than Patties, or skinless sausages let me know!

Gary T The first test batch we did was a little over the top sweet, however in the second one we tumbled it a little longer and made 100% sure all of the sugar was dissolved before adding the meat. Those two things seemed to help, the only reason for that that I could come up with was it prevented it from sitting on the outside of the meat and creating a film where it was the first thing you bit into because when we tumbled it long technically the meat took up MORE of the sugar but it deffinitely had slightly less of a sweet taste.

If anyone is looking to do this I can recommend the bold as a good base but if you are wanting to branch out and try a different seasoning I would recommend you stay with something with some heat to balance the sweetness.

skipdiggidy If you aren’t drying in that time at that temp I would think it might have something to do with how much water you added to the meat? Just a thought, it could have been anything (including the humidity outside that day) that caused it to have issues drying.

That sounds like a winner I will have to try it.

Parksider I’d agree with pretty much everything, the Parm Garlic is a more basic taste then what I was hoping for but I guess Parmesan might be a hard flavor to make really stand out in meat?

I am making more and more Inferno and adding Ghost Pepper or Sriracha Cheese to them. Philly Cheese Steak is an awesome one, play around with adding different cheeses to this, huge difference if you add Swiss or Mozz or Cheddar and all are good! I like the Medium #1 Best Seller (we call it Holly Regular in house) more than either 1504 or #10 but thats all just personal preference. The Supreme Pizza and the Habanero Mango are two that I love that yoi didn’t mention!

This is my tounge recipe. I get the tounge usually from people I work with that buy freezer beef from a farmer. They usually throw them out or feed them to the dog. NO WAY. Here is how I process the tounge.

Rinse the tounge well as it is dipped in a antiseptic. State law I think. Lay it out on your cutting board. Cut the tounge into at just back from where it tarts to narrow as the narrow part of the tounge has very little meat . Now take your sharp fillet knife and skin the little well marbled roast. Now lets make the juice. I like to use Mrs. Smiths dill pickle / Jalapeno mix follow the directions on the mix.
Then smoke it with your favorite wood till the internal temp for beef reaches 160 degrees . I then remove from the smoker and let cool for 20 minutes. I then cut the tounge into chunks about the size of sugar cubes and pack into a qt. jar. I then slice a Vidallia onion into rings and add to the qt. jar. I pour the pickling spice over it covering all of the tounge and onion. Install a lid and refrigerate for 2 days and enjoy. I take this to work and always bring home a empty jar. Another version is brad and butter pickle mix.

syno5 If you aren’t using a cure accelerator then I would always shoot for 12 hours, longer doesn’t really do anything and you do run the risk of the cure not being as effective in fighting off nasty bacteria and microorganisms if you hold it too long. Different Jerky Seasonings have different flavor profiles but the Bold is a fairly strong tasting seasoning that should give you a good strong jerky flavor though. So an important thing to keep in mind is to drag the slices through the seasoning and cure and make sure they are fully coated on both sides. Then I like to add the meat to a container without a lot of wasted space so that I can add as little water as possible, just enough to cover the slices.

As for drying before marinating that is not necessary but if you are looking for more smoke flavor in your jerkyand are using a smoker then you might want to pat it dry before laying it out on your screens. If you are using an oven and a dehydrator then this won’t make a difference.

Hi I’m looking for a meat department manager with experience at a chain retail supermarket near NYC area. I work for my family’s butcher shop with multiple locations. I’m looking to change up our operations and potentially even pay consulting fees too.

hbrednek Park Sider (as usual!) pretty much accurately broke it down for you. I love Collagen because it is easier to use than Hog or Sheep casings, no prep is needed and I also like the snap from a fresh collagen more than i like the snap from a hog casing. What I don’t like is exactly what your issue was with linking, they just don’t stay as tightly wrapped, one thing you can do that will help is after you link them and before you cut them put them in a freezer for about an hour. They will still have a tendency to come undone but they will hold a little better.

As for overstuffing it is a “feel” thing. You are most likely using too much pressure when holding the casing on the tube. A slightly understuffed casing is preferable in my opinion as you can simply twist it a few extra times and it will firm up where as an overstuffed casing will pop when you go to twist it.

ace202 Glad to have you on the board! First, yes, you do have to love the old world style but I would absolutely recommend you invest in some sort of probe thermometer. Just safer that way and prevents the sticks from being overcooked. 100% pork sticks are a good way to go an untrimmed pork butt will have just about the perfect amount of fat for a nice snack stick.

On to the casing question. 19-22mm sheep will be much larger than a pencil, more like a really thick sharpie. If you are looking for something the size of a pencil you would need 15 or maybe 16mm collagen casings. I would recommend you go with the 16mm smoked collagens first as you can buy a 3 pack of them which will be 3 strands and each strand will be 50 feet once stuffed. If you go with the 15mm you will have to buy an entire caddy which will be 50 strands so that would be enough to stuff 318 lb.

Now, you need a stuffing tube small enough for the 15 or 16mm casings to fit over. For more information on what size tube you will need check out the chart near the bottom of the page on the here.

One last thing to keep in mind, the smaller diameter casing and tube you are using the more force that is needed to stuff your product. To make your product easier to stuff make sure you keep it very cold before you stuff it, make sure it has around 25-30% fat content and you can add a little extra water. Adding water will increase your cook time a little but it will cook out eventually and is better than breaking your stuffer!

Jonathon
We never use it in snack sticks. We use 50/50 venison and pork butt mix. Always come out juicy. Just don’t overcook them in the smoker.

Papa Gale
I’d recommend getting sausage makers book called great sausage recipes in meat curing By founder Rytek Kutas. It has the most complete listing of sausage recipes I have ever seen I use it all the time as a reference guide. It has every ethnic version of sausage like kielbasa is Polish bratwurst is German chorizo is Mexican and so on.
To answer your question which sausage is most popular I think it’s a regional thing. I grew up in the Dutch Amish part of eastern Pennsylvania which has a huge German influences… The Amish still do fundraisers to this day selling sausage with just salt and pepper in it 100% pork.
As for a mix I use 50% pork butt to 50% venison. Or I use 100% pork I’ve never experimented with beef. But I do love Lebanon bologna and it’s no available here in Rochester so it’s on the list.
Favorite casing has to do with what I making if I want something that has a nice nap to it I will use fresh casing if I want something they can withstand the smoker and hang and it has a lot of weight to it or use the collagen. I use Walton’s fresh 32 & 21. They are the best! Also use 32 and 19 smoked for snack sticks.

Here is a package I vacuum sealed but have not frozen. It really doesn’t have any and I think they look good. I guess I need to open one and keep it in the fridge over night and see what happens. 0_1528240839404_IMG_1877.JPG

Jonathon Thanks

Hey Hip Granny, with a call sign like that…you gotta be a pretty hip granny!
I’ve had great success with slightly over drying my jerky and then letting it sit for a day or so and then I vacuum seal it it small quantities (maybe 10 or so pieces). I’ve had it stored that way out in the garage for over a year and it still tastes great and didn’t give anyone the craps so i think it’s good. I’m sure some will argue with me that I can’t do it like this but they can argue all they want, I have proof it works. I’ve never tried the snack stix this way, they’re usually have much more moisture content and I just don’t think it’ll work, but the jerky works great. My advice is try a small batch, let it sit as long a you dare…then open it, give it a good sniff test and then maybe a small bite or two and see what you think. Good luck.

Tom

Jonathon Thanks

mswoody6.4 Does the cheese tend to melt when you are cooking your snack sticks? That has been a problem for me in the past if I don’t use a high temp cheese, it melts out and leaves a cavity within my stick. I’m specifically wondering about the harder cheeses, if they maybe wouldn’t melt as much?

Thanks, i will do that.

I finally have the Chicken Thigh Brat video done and posted to youtube you can view it here https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/573/chicken-brats-made-from-thigh-meat I have to say it made a big difference and the South of the Border Cheddarwurst was a great choice, these were probably the best Chicken Brats I have made!

raider2119 I still havent had time to try this but I am absolutely going to be giving this a try in the next month or so. I’m just not sure I am going to be able to find the Yellow Pea, I think I have a local place that will have it but we will see!

medeling32 Yes, I do it all the time. The casings are softer, smaller and I like them better that way. I use the pizza brat seasoning. Your reason is the same as mine. Sometimes I just want a dog and fries. Yea, I boil them then a quick toasting n the grill to brown them up. Geo.

sausage king Yes, you can absolutely use the Blue Ribbon Maple Bacon Cure for Canadian Bacon if you are injecting and then covering in a 50% strength solution. If you are going to just brine it then you probably don’t want to use the Blue Ribbon Maple Cure as it has Sodium Erythorbate in it and it might gas out before it fully cures the loin. If you are going to brine/pickle then I would use the Country Brown Sugar Cure.

Either way you go the instructions for how to do both methods are available at https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/385/how-to-make-homemade-bacon-recipe

Let us know if you need anything else!

medeling32 Yes, Austin has a good post about this topic that should help you with this (https://meatgistics.waltonsinc.com/topic/174/using-a-scale-to-measure-seasoning-for-smaller-batches) For water I like to add 1 lb (same as 1 pint) to a 25 lb batch, it makes mixing and stuffing easier. That breaks down to .64 oz of water per lb.

Parksider
If the head size was equal between a pro-cut and weston, the pro-cut would win. But, since the #22 head size is much bigger than a #12, the 22 would win from weston in this scenario. The #22 Pro-Cut at only 1 HP would vastly outperform the Weston #22 at 1.5 hp.

On the shopping pages, there is a “shop by” (or “filter” on mobile) that has a section for manufacturer. You can filter there to choose Speco. We don’t stock many #22 from Speco but I think I’m going to add some more options there soon. This is what is currently stock items: https://www.waltonsinc.com/parts/grinders-parts/plates-knives/22-grinder-plates-knives?manufacturer=729
If/when I get some new options added there, I’ll let you know.

I really don’t have a great answer on the weston grinder knives for their length of use. They are made different from other knives, and don’t provide the same level of visual detail because of how they are designed to see the wear on them as well. If you are using them on all your plates though, it probably is time. For best results, you should pair 1 knife with 1 plate so they wear evenly together. Everything will last longer and be more efficient that way, but it does require more investment in buying additional knives to have 1 for every plate. If you’re plate is worn out though, it’d be safe to assume the knife is as well. I’d just use the plate as a guide for the knife on the weston versions.

I don’t know if the ice pack on the grinder really works. I think it is at least partially a marketing gimmick, but I’ve never fully tested to see if it truly makes a difference and keeps the meat colder. If the meat is really spending that much time in the throat of the grinder too, probably something wrong there or things would be better off with a faster grinder or bigger head to it. I kind of want to test this out though and find out for sure…

gerygaub Absolutely, you can send them to me at [email protected] and I would be happy to add them to your post, it will look just like you posted it. Just go ahead and do your post then email me and let me know what post to add it too! Can’t wait to see the pics!

I have both a 6 and 12 inch A-maze-n tubes, the guy that makes them is like 30 minutes away. Stopped and picked up the tubes and some flavored pellets last Friday but not had a chance to use them yet. Hopefully this weekend I will get some cheese smoked. I still need to do a batch of injected bacon this weekend too so I will be busy apparently.

Hey guys, doing chicken brats out of Thighs this week but can’t make up my mind on seasoning to use. Ali has a poll going on Walton’s inc Facebook page so if you are interested shoot over there and vote!

Jonathon Good Morning Jonathon. Pick the seasoning you want, since you are the one who is going to be eating them. :grin: Im interested in how the thighs will affect the texture, how you are going to grind them etc.

Thanks!

Pete Great question! Yes, the recommended 2 quarts of water does make stuffing much easier than if you were to use 1 qt. Now, using that much water will make your cook schedule a little longer. So, if you are not concerned with making your stuffing easier then you can use 1 qt and your cook time will be faster. I’ve never noticed a difference in the smooth or wrinkled texture when adding 1 or 2 qts, mostly when I see wrinkled casings it’s either cooking too hot too fast or lack of protein extraction during the mixing phase (if you haven’t seen it this is a pretty good video on protein extraction https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wStH-RtQUY8).

The consistency of the meat when adding the 2 qts of water might be significantly different depending on what binder you are using, I almost always add carrot fiber and that holds up to 26 times its weight in water. If you aren’t using a binder it might have a slightly soupy consistency but that excess water will cook out during the smoking/cooking process.

Let me know if I didn’t understand part of your question or if you have more!

medeling32 Absolutely, in general bratwurst seasonings work best with 100% pork anyway. I always take the left overs from stuffing and make patties out of it and the Inferno made a great patty! I’m not sure if you have watched it or not but Austin and I had a disagreement about the hottest brat seasoning (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DcaUOlOFWwg) He thought it was Habanero but I knew it was the Inferno, get ready for some heat!

medeling32
Any chance you are from PA? Ring bologna is huge around Philly where the Dutch Amish influence makes some awesome products.

harpo79 No, mix both the cure and the carrot fiber in with the meat and add the water, doing it the other way wont really hurt anything there is just no need and the carrot fiber might bind up the cure too efficiently. For water just use the 2 qts, that is more than enough. Using more won’t help your bind and it will increase your cook time. Remember if you are using encapsulated citric acid to go right to the smoker!

I hope this wasn’t too late to help!

I had a few other people look over your process and the consensus was that is sounds like it was either a mixing problem or the thermometer you were using failed and it ended up getting way over cooked. So try a new thermometer and try to make sure you get your product really sticky and tacky to ensure it has a good bind. If you try it again and have similar issues let us know!

gerygaub The carrot fiber will help for sure and as long as you are near or above 20% fat you should be okay. The issue with that is that Ground Sirloin is sometimes 90% or more lean. You might want to try adding some Cold Phosphate for moisture retention? Maybe hold off on adding that for your first batch and just add it if it comes out dry?

The Cheeseburger Cheddarwurst comes with sure cure so it can be smoked or you can leave out the cure and make it fresh. If you add the cure and smoke it just make sure you get REALLY good protein extraction to help prevent the fat from rendering out during the smoking process. If you are not curing and smoking and are making a fresh product let it cook at lower temperatures initially on the grill or in the pan, same goal here we don’t want any fat to render out.

Your creation sounds amazing and I don’t know if you knew it or not but we have declared this the Month of Bacon at Walton’s so when you make these please post pictures of them to Meatgistics and if you want either the Meatgistics or Waltons Facebook or twitter or wherever!

Jonathon
Thanks Jon! Will try a binder on next batch! I appreciate the quick response!

Tubby

Well you got my brain spinning too much and I couldn’t stop thinking of pepperoni so now I have been making pepperoni all day and shooting a video about it! I’ll have the video up hopefully in just a couple of days!

medeling32 Yes, normally I use 100% pork. Though I have done 100% beef, a 50/50 mix of beef and pork and even 100% chicken breast. It really comes down to what you want in it. If you are using chicken just remember to use a binder or your sausage will be dry and won’t bind well.

Let us know if you need anything else!

dennishoddy It depends on what type of casing you are using, if you are using cellulose casings then you probably will need to either tie them or use hogs rings, tying them would be my suggestion there. If you are using natural casings like sheep or hogs then you shouldn’t need to use anything at all, they should stay twisted once done. If you are using collagen casings then you can twist them but once you cut them they casing will come open a little, you could tie these if you want but I generally don’t, as long as collagen casings are cooked at the correct temperature they should expand too much past the casing.

For a good example of how to twist casings go to the 4:35 mark of this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_FgktFx4Xg Austin is twisting cellulose casings here but it shows how to twist.

Let us know if you need anything else!

gerygaub
You should link then smoke them. I smoke for 2 hours then simmer them in my turkey fryer pot till they reach 160. We put the pot on our wood stove. Keep it around 170 to 180.
I ice bath them THEN cut the links and remove the casing.
Watch a you tube video to learn how to link.
Keep them linked throughout the entire cooking process.

gerygaub I have a Weston 44 lb meat mixer back in the video room, I took it apart and am attaching pictures of what I think is missing, it is just one bronze piece and then the black knob screws into this. It is called a Pivot Pin and I would imagine you could order a new one from Weston.

0_1522960321062_IMG_1837.jpg

Jonathon thank you sir!