Addatives Encapsulated Citric Acid
Papa Gale last edited by
Austin I read in your catalog not to regrind meat with encapsulated citric acid could you explain why you should not regrind? We coarse gring into our mixer then add seasonings regrind fine and stuff into cassings from the grinder.
Also could you explain why do not hold overnight what happens if a emergency came up and you could not smoke right away and you had to hold over night in the fridge?
Thanks your videos are great.
Encapsulated citric acid is a citric acid coated with hydrogenated cotton seed oil which melts during thermal processing, releasing the citric acid at the correct time during smoking or cooking. If you re-grind with encapsulated citric acid in the meat product, you risk breaking the encapsulate and not having it release normally and at the correct time. If you had an emergency and had to hold overnight, you probably just make due with what you have. The meat product won’t go bad, but you risk the encapsulate not doing what is supposed to do in this case as well. You will still end up with a sausage that is completely edible in both scenarios, but it may not be in the ideal form and end result you were expecting.
Hope that helps! Let me know if I can help clarify anything further!
Papa Gale last edited by
@Austin thanks for the quick reply.
Your explanation was very informative.
If I put a kidney plate in my grinder and a stuffing tube would that damage the encapsulated citric acid?
@Papa-Gale That would probably be fine. I’d typically use a Star Stuffing Adapter in that scenario with a grinder, but you could run the grinder without a knife in it and the kidney plate. The plate should hold the auger in place and with the larger holes on the kidney plate, it should minimize any over-working, smearing of meat, or breaking of capsules. Might consider it still slightly less ideal than using a star stuffing adapter or slightly less than using a sausage stuffer, but I’d be confident enough in that process that it would be successful and shouldn’t be a big deal.
Let me know if I can help with anything else!
Jnar4 last edited by
@Austin does the cotton seed coating melt at 152? I ran a batch with the recommended rate and it was extremely sour vs tangy as I expected. If I didn’t hit my target temp would that have been the issue. I’ve been hesitant ever since or use half the amt. thx Jeff
@Jnar4 It melts at about 135 F. (Recommended to be above that temp for 1 hour). If you had a problem using it before, you can definitely use less. We recommend 4oz per 25lb of meat, but you’d be fine to use less if you think you want some tanginess but it’s too strong at the normal level. If you wanted, you can remove it from your process entirely. If you don’t use encapsulated citric acid, you just lose the tangy flavor and some of the the shelf stability benefits of having a lower pH, and you may want to then add a different cure accelerator (Smoked Meat Stabilizer) if you cook immediately after stuffing.
Let me know if I can help with anything more.
mcherbies last edited by
I made 20 lbs of Summer Sausage with and 20 lbs without ECA. Both batches were my normal recipe. The batches with ECA were definitely tangy…maybe to much.
I was looking for an alternative to Fermento as the recipe calls. What I have used in the past is Powdered Buttermilk. I have to hold it in the fridge for a couple of days to get the tang I want. ECA is great if don’t want to wait to smoke the meats. I usually need to mix and stuff one day…then smoke another, starting first thing in the morning. That way the batch is finished before I want to go to bed. Has anyone else used powdered buttermilk?
If the ECA was too tangy, you can just use less, if you are happy with the results of your sausage else wise.
The amount we typically recommend (4 oz per 25 lb meat) is at a level to try and lower the pH enough to get as close to reaching more of a shelf stable product as we can. But, it doesn’t have to be used at that high of a usage level.
I can’t recommend to use buttermilk, because I’ve never used it. The concept kind of makes sense though. You are adding something with a lower pH than the meat, to get the meat pH just a bit lower and add some tangy flavor. The biggest problem I see though with using something like buttermilk and immediately lowering the pH is this… A lower pH will reduce water holding capacity, and can make a sausage dry and crumbly after cooking. This is one reason why encapsulated citric acid is coated, and that coating doesn’t melt until 135 F +. If you add buttermilk and lower that pH immediately, I am not sure that the results will be quite the same, and you could end up with a dryer or crumbly sausage. I’ve never used buttermilk though, so I can’t say for sure, but that’s my thoughts anyways.
@scottwaltner i too used to have that same problem until I made my mix about 30 percent fat added non fat powder milk for a binder and mixed till it gets good and sticky and then the rest cooking temp and water shower @ end.
@parksider I am using fibrous casings and soaking in warm water for alt least 30 minutes. I mixed the meat, 20 pounds for about 12 minutes. The casings were tight when I was stuffing them. I was processing at 125 for 1 hour, 140 for 1 hour, 155 for 2 hours and 170 until the internal was 165. I water bathed them, forgot to hang them over night, but just put them in the refrigerator. I didn’t take the internal temp after I water bathed them.
The outside of the sausage does not appear fatty and the flavor is great.
Ive been wrong many times before lol! But i dont feel like it would turn out super good unless you found a seasoning mix that would blend well with the bacon taste which might take some nasty sticks to figure it out. Possibly willies snack stick from waltons might be ok… if you do this please let us know how it turns out. Commercially seems like a bit of a bad thing, the cost of bacon/pork fat is huge. Profit margin would be horrid!
@scottwaltner i agree with parker on a few things. You always need to soak your fibrous summer sausage casings for sure! At least 30 minutes if you got time. Also you dont want the casings to stick too much to the meat either though. Fine line there. I think maybe you need to mix the meat longer for that protein extraction would be the main thing. Also you want to stuff those casings about as tight as you can with out exploding, but those casings are tough. What temperature is the summer sausage after cooling them down?
I want to make fresh not smoked nitrate free Hot Dogs. After stuffing I am hot bathing them to 160. These are all beef I must add. What can I use to keep the color so they don’t end up grey looking and have that nice pink color?
Very similar process. Try dividing the spice into 1/3’s. Rub 1/3 on each day for 3 days. Yes it’s very thin, doesn’t take much. Local hardware store had crocks on sale so i got 2. I rub, and rotate each day.
After day 3, rotate each day for 5 more days. If it’s cold out i leave on the floor in my garage, if not it goes in the fridge-great either way just depends on weather.
Hang one day-i never rinse. Cold smoke (100F) for 6 hours. rest overnight, cold smoke for 6 more hours. Rest overnight.
I like mine to be a deep cherry color, that’s how i determine when to stop smoking. If it’s not that rich cherry color, smoke it more! Then rest it for 3 days and slice. We slice it on a slicer so i get super thin slices. Uncle Cecil said slice it thin enough that you can read the paper through it!
One tip-Walton’s has the little drying pouch that’s in the store bought jerky, They are cheap and make it last forever in the fridge or freezer. I also vacuum seal to 98% with the chamber vac or it get too hard. Here is a pic of what I’m looking for. The fellas have named this George Washington Jerky. It was the only way i could explain it to them before i made it. Told them we were going VERY old school, and now they love it!